Wednesday, August 24, 2005
a mouth full of Dickau
PO and I disagree somewhat on the Dickau signing, so out of laziness, instead of writing two separate articles, today we present transcripts from an email dialogue.
Chestnutt - So here we have it, the sum total of Danny Ainge's foray into the FA market - two overpaid honkies getting way too much credit for being “character guys.” When Scalabrine signed I gave Danny a pass because it wasn't for much money, but we have two guys who, if not for DA's largesse very well could have been out of basketball in two years, now consuming approximately 10% of the payroll. I don't like it. Death by a thousand cuts (or more aptly, 4 legitimately bad contracts - MB, DD, BS, RL). Dick-owww is probably the less offensive of the two signings, but they both spell "franchise regressing" to me.
PO - While not as down on these moves as you, it seems to me that these two signings have as much to do with off the court reasons than on. Because the captain of the team is uninterested in being a captain, Danny has gotten himself two “smart” players who, no doubt, will be great influences off the court, and won’t kill us on the court. If that’s the case, save the money and just trade Pierce.
Chestnutt - The problem is that getting these guys only makes sense if Pierce is gone. These guys can't do shit on the court, and they are in no way going to be able to undo the Pissy-Pierce team identity stranglehold. It's all well and good that Scalab-urine stays late at the gym working on his free throws, but I'm thinking TA, Gerald Green and KP are going to take their emotional cues from the guy who (rightly or wrongly) has made the all-star team four times and has thousands (or is it hundreds? haha) of people in the stands wearing his jersey. It's just a credibility thing. People in any field are more likely to emulate the most accomplished and productive member of the office/team rather than the jovial but ultimately lesser-accomplished colleague. They may go to lunch with the jovial guy, but they take their cues from the fuckhead who sells the most cars. You dig? That’s why Payton was able to make an impact – he was effective early on and has HOF credentials that players have to respect. DD and BS are good for the team if it's driven by the rookies and we're losing a lot, but with PP and the whole "mediocre .500 crapfest" going on, they are simply extraneous and overpaid.
PO - While I agree with you in theory, I think it’s different in this case because I don’t think the kids like Pierce. He’s probably a dick to them, he’s always making those comments about not wanting to rebuild (who wants to be thought of as someone not ready to compete in the NBA), and he doesn’t pass them the fucking ball when they’re in. I’d wager several think they are better ball players than him. Pierce is inherited garbage, and Danny has set the precedent that if you work hard you’ll be taken care of. He’s signed Reed, Gomes, Scal and Dickau all to long-term contracts. What do they all have in common, hard working good influences with questionable talent rather than good talent with questionable influence. DA thinks he has the talent in the young guys, he just needs the good influences.
AJ and GG better be fucking good, or the blueprint is way fucked up.
Chestnutt – I agree the kids probably don’t like Pierce (easy enough to read between the lines in their quotes to the press and the general bench pecking order that seems evident during games), but that’s also part of the point. He’s the big kahuna, the only NBA ‘star’ they’ve played with in their career, and a presence that all the Scab-on-my-Dick-oww’s are never going to abate. I think the importance of the young players’ lack of a relationship with Pierce is that the team will have no morale implosion if/when he’s traded. They’ll lose, but it will be their team that’s losing.
AJ is a lot closer to being the next Jermaine O’Neal than he is the next Amare Stoudamire. That’s good enough for me, but he’s not the world-beater some are predicting.
As for GG, I think we should start making entirely baseless predictions just to fall in line with everyone else in Celtics-Nation (the concept, not the board you terrorize) who seems to have an opinion of a guy they’ve never seen play. I’m telling you PO, he’s the next Rudy Gay!
PO - I’m a Gay Lover! (Thanks for the set up)
Well, if Big Al is an O’Neal in three years, and Green becomes an ’02 Pierce in four, than you need complimentary players like Dick and Scal at that time. Hell, maybe we should have signed them longer term! At the very least, they can help the boys do their taxes (I know, cheap whitey joke).
When it comes down to it, Dickau is a better PG than the other four currently on the team. I can see Scal being 2nd or 3rd off the bench. Each player will average over 20 minutes a game this year. Perhaps that is an indictment of the team rather than an affirmation of their ability, but they’re relatively cheap and will not embarrass the C’s on or off the court.
Chestnutt - true enough I suppose. Trade Pierce!
Chestnutt - So here we have it, the sum total of Danny Ainge's foray into the FA market - two overpaid honkies getting way too much credit for being “character guys.” When Scalabrine signed I gave Danny a pass because it wasn't for much money, but we have two guys who, if not for DA's largesse very well could have been out of basketball in two years, now consuming approximately 10% of the payroll. I don't like it. Death by a thousand cuts (or more aptly, 4 legitimately bad contracts - MB, DD, BS, RL). Dick-owww is probably the less offensive of the two signings, but they both spell "franchise regressing" to me.
PO - While not as down on these moves as you, it seems to me that these two signings have as much to do with off the court reasons than on. Because the captain of the team is uninterested in being a captain, Danny has gotten himself two “smart” players who, no doubt, will be great influences off the court, and won’t kill us on the court. If that’s the case, save the money and just trade Pierce.
Chestnutt - The problem is that getting these guys only makes sense if Pierce is gone. These guys can't do shit on the court, and they are in no way going to be able to undo the Pissy-Pierce team identity stranglehold. It's all well and good that Scalab-urine stays late at the gym working on his free throws, but I'm thinking TA, Gerald Green and KP are going to take their emotional cues from the guy who (rightly or wrongly) has made the all-star team four times and has thousands (or is it hundreds? haha) of people in the stands wearing his jersey. It's just a credibility thing. People in any field are more likely to emulate the most accomplished and productive member of the office/team rather than the jovial but ultimately lesser-accomplished colleague. They may go to lunch with the jovial guy, but they take their cues from the fuckhead who sells the most cars. You dig? That’s why Payton was able to make an impact – he was effective early on and has HOF credentials that players have to respect. DD and BS are good for the team if it's driven by the rookies and we're losing a lot, but with PP and the whole "mediocre .500 crapfest" going on, they are simply extraneous and overpaid.
PO - While I agree with you in theory, I think it’s different in this case because I don’t think the kids like Pierce. He’s probably a dick to them, he’s always making those comments about not wanting to rebuild (who wants to be thought of as someone not ready to compete in the NBA), and he doesn’t pass them the fucking ball when they’re in. I’d wager several think they are better ball players than him. Pierce is inherited garbage, and Danny has set the precedent that if you work hard you’ll be taken care of. He’s signed Reed, Gomes, Scal and Dickau all to long-term contracts. What do they all have in common, hard working good influences with questionable talent rather than good talent with questionable influence. DA thinks he has the talent in the young guys, he just needs the good influences.
AJ and GG better be fucking good, or the blueprint is way fucked up.
Chestnutt – I agree the kids probably don’t like Pierce (easy enough to read between the lines in their quotes to the press and the general bench pecking order that seems evident during games), but that’s also part of the point. He’s the big kahuna, the only NBA ‘star’ they’ve played with in their career, and a presence that all the Scab-on-my-Dick-oww’s are never going to abate. I think the importance of the young players’ lack of a relationship with Pierce is that the team will have no morale implosion if/when he’s traded. They’ll lose, but it will be their team that’s losing.
AJ is a lot closer to being the next Jermaine O’Neal than he is the next Amare Stoudamire. That’s good enough for me, but he’s not the world-beater some are predicting.
As for GG, I think we should start making entirely baseless predictions just to fall in line with everyone else in Celtics-Nation (the concept, not the board you terrorize) who seems to have an opinion of a guy they’ve never seen play. I’m telling you PO, he’s the next Rudy Gay!
PO - I’m a Gay Lover! (Thanks for the set up)
Well, if Big Al is an O’Neal in three years, and Green becomes an ’02 Pierce in four, than you need complimentary players like Dick and Scal at that time. Hell, maybe we should have signed them longer term! At the very least, they can help the boys do their taxes (I know, cheap whitey joke).
When it comes down to it, Dickau is a better PG than the other four currently on the team. I can see Scal being 2nd or 3rd off the bench. Each player will average over 20 minutes a game this year. Perhaps that is an indictment of the team rather than an affirmation of their ability, but they’re relatively cheap and will not embarrass the C’s on or off the court.
Chestnutt - true enough I suppose. Trade Pierce!
# posted by Dr. Chestnutt @ 3:32 PM 
